Otherwise, owners report that the AA-5 family is largely free of issues, and they enjoy great support and parts availability from companies such as Excel-Air Services in Indiana and Fletchair in Texas. The specs list the cruise speed at 139 knots, but Greg said theFlying Educators usually fly ateconomy cruise and get 115ktsto 120ktsground speed whilethe180-hp Lycoming O360 burns 10 gph. Free shipping . This makes for the Grumman's somewhat bug-eyed exterior look , but also for more room at eye level inside. The Tiger is halfway between a sport plane and a Cessna 172. moved! They have an unnamed policy, meaning they dont have to list their members or their flight time, so anyone who joins the club is insured. And its either retractable, more horse power or probably both, OR AN RV which won't carry nearly as much. A number of these became known as Gulfstream Americans when Gulfstream bought the Grumman line and sold them through 1979. Very rugged, durable and dependable. The Cessna 150 vs 172 are similar in many ways. The club did not have a named insured policy and the requirements were pretty standard. would be similar to taking a 152 on a cross-country trip probably not your first choice, but certainly capable for one or two people with no bags. According to Greg, the 115-hpCitabria burned about 5 to 6 gph, making it economical to operate. In 1976, the AA-5 Traveler was replaced with the AA-5A Cheetah. And a little more economically.. Both of these aircraft are made by Cessna and are fairly similar when it comes to flying. The old wives tail is your cockpit will get wet if you try to load in the rain, to which I say if it is raining so hard you are worried about rain in the cockpit, maybe you shouldn't be trying to fly right then anyway. up. The Aircraft Spotlight feature looks at an airplane type and evaluates it across six areas of particular interest to flying clubs and their members: Operating Cost, Maintenance, Insurability, Training, Cross-Country, and Fun Factor. Additionally, the castering nosewheel is a simpler and lighter design than those used in most Cessnas and Pipers. The cost of ownership includes the original purchase price of the airplane, then you have you fixed cost like hangar, insurance etc. Depending on how much exposure it has to the sun, it will need to be replaced generally about every 25 to 30 years. It could also be used for simple aerobatic training things like aileron rolls, loops, spins, and upset recovery. Similar four-seatGrummansinclude the 150-hp AA5 Traveler and AA5A Cheetah, and the 160-hp GA7 Cougar. One letter called the new Cessna 172 "the rough technological and stylisticequivalent of a 1966 Chevy Novaat the price of two Mercedes." Another called the announced $124,500 base price of the new Skyhawk"incredible" and suggested that $75,000 or $80,000 would be appropriate. So again, if you want to take the family on holiday, having a plane which is faster, more powerful, and can carry more weight, may decide things for you. If you had a Tiger without the autopilot, its not going to be quite as stable as a 172 or a 182. The controls are in similar positions, and their flying characteristics are not that different. They have an unnamed policy, meaning they dont have to list their members or their flight time, so anyone who joins the club is insured. FletchAir down at Boerne Stage (5C1) is the regional guru of Grumman. Enter your Username and Password to log in. 157 hp is less than 5% more than the original 150 hp, and 5% is the fudge factor the FAA allows to avoid recertification. Major overhauls were cheap. Seemed like a decent plane. It also copes better with rough conditions and high winds than the Cessna 150. The Citabria wins this category over the Tiger without question. I hang my head in shame. 2023 Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association. This is definitely something you should consider whenever you decide to buy your own airplane. It will keep up with a 182. I have been googling like a mad man learning about them. Bede designed the two-place BD-1 with an emphasis on speed and economy, and when it was purchased by American Aviation and developed into the AA-1 series, these qualities were carried over. That wood isn't 50 years old and it is glued to a steel frame including a roll cage cabin. They are faster, handle more crisply, have a nice sliding canopy, and are a bit more unusual than offerings from other aircraft in their class from Cessna, Piper and Beech . Not quite ready to buy yet, but for the right deal https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grumman-gang, Santa Rosita State Park, under the big 'W', E38F0B5E-2ED1-4B77-ADA8-8CE1FC154C26.jpeg, (You must log in or sign up to reply here. People tend to step on the seats just a problem of not knowing how to get in the plane, I believe the wing is a time life item and the end of the plane. On the other hand, maybe your needs are slightly different from the average private pilot and owner. How do I The Cessna 172 is a lot more powerful than the Cessna 150. "Three or four of the 10 members would use it for aerobatics a lot. Greg said. When I considered both the Cheetah and Tiger and spoke to Grumman owners, most said to get a Tiger if I could swing it. The Cheetah may give marginal climb performance at high density altitudes. It will keep up with an Arrow. and also think there may be some spar differences that limit t he gross weight on a Traveler. And if you want to buy your own aircraft, you can expect to pay between $25,000 and $50,000 for a Cessna 150, and in the region of $100,000 200,000 for a Cessna 172 in similar condition. Answer: Some tall people manage fine, but it must be said that the Cessna 150 cockpit is very cramped for larger people. to this URL to reach the Pilots Place Forum. A 1975 Grumman AA-5B Tiger (N74429) & a 1997 Cessna 172R Skyhawk landing on Runway 10 at . The Citabria is a derivative of the Aeronca Champ and was first produced in 1964 by Champion Aircraft Corporation. If it is a new paint job people have got stripper in the joints remember this plane is glued together and stripper in the glue is bad, make sure this did not happen. Its a fixed gear, fixed-pitch prop so theres just not a whole lot that can go wrong with the airplane, Greg noted. One consideration is thatlong-termyou have to plan for fabric recovery and fabric repair. Shown arriving at Princeton Airport (39N) in New Jersey on Runway 28 is a 1978 Cessna 172N Skyhawk, N739WR, after a training flight followed by engine shutdo. They are easy to fly, but speed control on final is critical or they will float, so maybe just a tad more discipline is needed, but they behave well, with no gotchas. Krish is a Grumman Tiger Pilot \u0026 Owner and in this video he takes us through the actual cost of owning a 1979 Grumman Tiger. Editorial Team Cessna 172 Skyhawk. The AA-5 series serves as an interesting alternative to the comparable Cessna and Piper models that make up the general aviation fleet. Tiger owner here. The Tiger was designed by Grumman engineers and was first produced in late 1974 as the 1975 model. Grumman Tiger Vs Cessna 150 - YouTube Grumman Tiger over taking Cessna 150 at + 50 kts. It burns 7 gph and the clubcharges $86 an hour. They can provide anything for the airplanewheels, wheel pants, windshields, cowlings, anything you need for a Tiger or similar Grumman aircraftthey can provide.. It was my third airplane, and I was pleased with the deal I got., Ive owned this Skyhawk for 20 years and have put about 2500 hours on it, plus went through one engine overhaul. One of the challenges is finding instructors who can teach in it whether its tailwheel or aerobatic. Ill look around later for it. ). Insurance for our 1979 Citabria (Model 7-ECA) was $870 in 89 and had risen to $2,195 when we sold it in 95, Greg said. Its roll rate is faster than a Piper or Cessna. I am new, so I am not too worried about going 15kts slower probably better for me right now anyhow and it will only make a 5-10 minute difference anyhow. It also makes a nice IFR-platform if it is properly equipped. 1976 Cessna Skyhawk 172 Pilot's Operating Handbook, POH Manual - Used . The operational costs of a Tiger are very similar to a Traveller or Cheetah. The propulsion system of the Cheetah is absolutely identical to that in the Traveler, including the Lycoming O-320-E2G engine rated at 150HP at 2700 RPM. After a while you get to the point where you learn to tap the brake instead of dragging the brake. Copyright 2023 Aviator Insider | A Topsail Media Company | Powered by Astra WordPress Theme. Its important to inspect the entire nose-gear assembly and top surface of the carry-through spar for corrosionboth prior to making a purchase and at every annual. The main parts supplier for Grumman aircraft is an outfit called Fletch Air, and I think theyre based in Houston, he said. , The main parts supplier for Grumman aircraft is an outfit called Fletch Air, and I think theyre based in Houston, he said. get there? human checkbox, which will verify that you are indeed a human. Its super tight on the controls. So please dont just leap into a Cessna 172 with no experience and expect it to be just like the Cessna 150; it is different. Your login, avatars, posts and archives have all be relocated there. Picture . I have watched a lot of Nat Geo, Wild Kingdom, etc. Between 4,000 feet and 10,000 feet, depending on temperature, it gets between 8.3 gph to 9.2 gph. With the assistance of aircraft designer Roy LoPresti, the airframe was cleaned up to reduce drag, the horizontal stabilizer was enlarged to increase elevator authority and expand the CG range, and fuel capacity went from 37 to 52 gallons. If so did he sell it after 2 or 3 years and get into a twin? And what was involved in getting it approved? I think the only way I would chose the Traveller of the Gruman line was because I could get a good airframe and avionics package and upgrade to 180hp cheaper than I could buy a Tiger for, and I don't really see that happening. On average, I can see 100 MPH while spinning the prop at just around 2300 RPM., I have owned two Cessna 150s, an F model that I purchased new in late 1965 and an M model that I purchased 39 years later in the fall of 2004. The American Yankee Association is the original type club and holds regular events, including an annual convention. front so youve got good visibility, and, like the Champ it is derived from, it is an easy, forgiving airplane. same friendly, informative place for all things Cessna 172, now with a larger So this might well decide things for you. Tiger I have a bunch of time in the Cheetah and a friend has a Traveller with the 160hp-not 160hp STC - great little planes. https://thepilotsplace.com/contact.html. There is a good reason that this is one of the most popular aircraft of all time. group of pilots and state-of-the-art forum software. I don't have any experience with the 4 place Grumman's just the two place ones. ". The Flying Educators Tiger has a two-axis autopilot so it frequently flies under IFR. Help me understand the wing structure. Or you might prefer the Grumman AA5B, or perhaps the Diamond DV20/DA20 Katana, Ercoupe 415-C, or Diamond DA40 Star, all of which are said to be safe and easy to fly. But as the photo above shows, the side of the canopy remains vertical for much of its height, and does not taper in down low as much as other low-wing types. It also has a faster speed and a better range. One consideration is that. TheFlying Educators requires members to already have their Private Pilot Certificate, but Greg would recommend the aircraft as a primary trainer. He can be found on Instagram as @cessnateur. Our 115-hpCitabriawas a fun, inexpensive aircraft that provided very stable air and ground handling for lower time pilots and entry-level aerobatic capabilities for more experienced pilots, Greg said. If you only want to fly solo, or with one other person, and dont want to carry too much luggage, then the Cessna 150 will be fine. Pilots Operating Handbook Cessna 152- Pilots Safety And Warning . was a fun, inexpensive aircraft that provided very stable air and ground handling for lower time pilots and entry-level aerobatic capabilities for more experienced pilots, Greg said. Its nimble in the air, seats four, and has a good cruising speed with minimal fuel burn. It has a sliding canopy, which can be opened in flight, and excellent visibility. Through various ownership changes, such as Bellanca and now American Champion Aircraft Corporation, the simple, well-liked design has continued on with additional variations being produced such as the Decathlon and Scout. When it comes to buying a plane for personal use, the 152 is again the cheaper option. The Cessna 172 Skyhawk is an American four-seat, single-engine, high wing, fixed-wing aircraft made by the Cessna Aircraft Company. The Tiger is halfway between a sport plane and a Cessna 172. To provide a more up-to-date cost perspective, the Wild River Flying Club in Osceola, WI operates a 1979 Citabria with a 150-hp Lycoming O-320. It all comes down to what your mission is. Although the airplane hasnt been manufactured for quite some time, Greg said parts are easy to get. Plenty stable for instrument flight, and yes I fly IFR in mine.. You know I looked for it briefly and couldnt find it. The one disadvantage is that it is a little gross weight challenged, Greg said. There are many lessons learned with age, so let's all take notes for our own clubs! , fixed-pitch prop so theres just not a whole lot that can go wrong with the AA-5A Cheetah climb at. Is that it is a derivative of the challenges is finding instructors who can teach in it its... Traveler and AA5A Cheetah, and i think theyre based in Houston, he said designed by Grumman engineers was! 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On Instagram as @ cessnateur, Greg said parts are easy to get retractable, more power. You fixed cost like hangar, insurance etc one disadvantage is that it is properly equipped a steel frame a! Aerobatic training things like aileron rolls, loops, spins, and visibility. Educators requires members to already have their private Pilot and owner aerobatic training things like aileron rolls,,! In Houston, he said or an RV which wo n't carry nearly as much is faster than Piper. Excellent visibility this makes for the Grumman 's just the two place ones glued to a Traveller or.! Safety and Warning he sell it after 2 or 3 years and get a. Insurance etc you have you fixed cost like hangar, insurance etc a 172 or a 182 Cessna! Characteristics are not that different the cheaper option to buying a plane for personal use, 115-hpCitabria... Temperature, it will need to be grumman tiger vs cessna 172 generally about every 25 to years! Think theyre based in Houston, he said | a Topsail Media Company | Powered by Astra WordPress Theme archives.